Did Will and Lyra have sex?

[Neptune]

I agree. Considering their ages I really don't think they had sex. I think the connection was through the kiss and touching of each others Dæmon. The meaning goes deeper than just a physical connection.

My theory is that the Dæmon can't. Not the human. I thought the human can, or else the whole point of my posts here are hypocricy!

think of the babies!! /lol

Yep the Dæmon can't have baby therefore... or maybe that's how their baby's Dæmon born? Hey good idea!

[Uzumaki007]

mibbe yes mibbe no

[Rosie*]

I don't think the Dæmon of two people who love eachother have sex. Cause, for instance, my Dæmon is a mouse, and the Dæmon of my lover is a lion, then that'd be rather difficult (A)

[faze]

I dunno... I always thought that they just spontaniously appeared, when the kid is born. Also, I don't think that Dæmon get frisky when humans do. Witness the snow lepoard and the golden monker at the end of NL.

[Desmond Hume]

I don't think the Dæmon of two people who love eachother have sex. Cause, for instance, my Dæmon is a mouse, and the Dæmon of my lover is a lion, then that'd be rather difficult (A)

.....are you serious? I mean, I agree that Dæmon probably don't have sex, but.....your reasoning behind this is...wow....

[jennay2]

I felt like maybe Lyra and Will did have sex, but I'd rather not dwell on it. I think this, because that priest knew they were going to, and was determined to stop them.

And I think we all know 12 year olds are capable of sex, and to think otherwise is foolish.

Jeez louise, why would Dæmon have sex?? Their souls, not actual animals!

[coopsoup247]

Near the end of TAS, Lyra asks Pan whether he'll ever tell her what he and Kirjava did while they were apart. Pan says

"one day" he said "And she'll tell Will one day. We agreed that we'd know when the time had come, but we wouldn't tell either of you till then"

What does this sound like. Do you think "when the time comes" he'll tell her they had a picnic.

Personally I don't think Will and Lyra had sex but there is evidence for both sides.

For: Some people are saying that it is impossible for them to have sex because they are only 12. 16 is only the limit by human laws(in england anyway), but by natures laws it is possible to have sex at that age.

They would know naturally how to have sex, they wouldn't need tutoring. It's in their Genes. Animals learn to have sex and I don't see their mothers giving them lessons.

Also them to having sex wouldn't spoil there love, it would heighten it (probably not to the reader though(except perverts)). PP wouldn't put that in anyway.

Also Lyra is destined to commit the great fall like Eve did. How often is something as big as that merely falling in love and kissing.In Paradise Lost, after Adam and Eve both eat the apple, they madly make love.

BTW why have most people in comments say they didn't have sex but in the vote, more people said they did???

Against: PP didn't even imply it in anyway, after they fall in love, PP doesn't go into any more detail of their relationship after that.

Lyra and Will should have more sense than that. They should know about pregnancy. Obviously, they didn't have conteception? What would happen if Lyra became pregnant? Would the baby even survive? Would Lyra survive?

[KenBrasai]

Personaly, I think yes. How could the universe be saved with just a kiss

[CMR]

as long as this doesn't go on for 57 pages like the one on BTTS.net then it wont be that weird

Whoops...

[jfrcoates]

as long as this doesn't go on for 57 pages like the one on BTTS.net then it wont be that weird

Whoops...

Well, we're only at 38 pages.

[CMR]

So far...

[JoeSchmo]

... i don't think we're helping...

[chiaroscuro]

The big error is to think that sex is just the sexual intercourse, sex or making love goes beyond that, the kiss described in the book is more erotic than any sex scene we can imagine between Lyra and Will, Personally i don´t think they have actual sex, that is as pointed in other comments very improbable.

One question, why we are so obsessed with sex? thats the result of the puritan religious education we receive.

[Neptune]

We're obsessed by sex because that's human nature. And Lyra and Will has a Human Nature.

[faze]

Yeah...
What they actually did is irrelevant. It's what they felt that matters.

[Cheater]

Now that I think about it, I dont think they did.

But if they were say two years older, that night they spent together would have been magical.

[Kirjava96]

Its a bit weird, i think just a kiss is far enough but not actually having sex.

[TowerDragon]

Ok I'm my turn to chime in on this topic but when I first read the books I thought that the Touching of ones Dæmon was a sign of a sexual act but not actually having sex themselves. I truly look at it this way however after so much that Will and Lyra went through the idea that they had sex does not surprise me in the least. Will and Lyra risked there happiness to save every universe in existence so if they got a little action on the side I have no problem because I believe that their love was pure. The idea that they had sex is kinda of a mute point for me.

[LyraSilvertongue11]

i don't think they had sex.
(the obvious one) there were only kids, like 12 or 13.
but mayb touchin each other's Dæmon's were a version of sex in Lyra's world.....
i don't know mayb, mayb not.
i think a kiss was probably far enough mayb if they were a bit older.......
unless philip pullman decides to do another book (hopeful ) then we'll probably never know.....

[Aneiryu]

Well, I do know that when Lyra and Will touched eachother's dæmon's in the mulefa's world, they both received a feeling that most likely was akin to orgasm. < <;; I do not think they actually had sex, though; I never got that impression. Even so, though, I believe their love was pure, and whether they had sex or not does not really matter to me.

[ninteen45]

A mod proved this, on the first page...

[GSmoke827]

They were 12 or 13, sex is a bit of an older person activity. This could be considered a horrible thought to have, but I see the point. I don't think sex was really on their minds. I mean, true love and affection for one another doesn't mean they need to have sex to show it. And perhaps it is that undisturbed love that makes them strong enough to rebuild the kingdom of heaven separately, and to give Will the ability upon separation to destroy the knife.

[4609]

You have a point, definitly there was no thought about.... but Will did want to have children but i don't think he wanted to do it until later

[coocanet]

Hmmm... I'm kinda torn on this one.
I'm leaning more to the idea that they had sex though... It just.. makes more sense if they did it. The entire book series, PP was building up this massive anticipation of the Adam and Eve and temptation thing. It just doesn't make sense how their kissing and true love is what can change the universe. I don't see how only their love and kissing is SO special over everyone elses... and falling in love and kissing isn't considered sinful. Sex isn't sinful either but to have premarital sex, in the christian world, is sinful. The witch's prophecy said that Lyra (Eve) would be tempted by the tempter (Dr.Malone/Serpent). SOOO, it needs to somehow parallel the story of Adam of Eve to make some sense. After the serpent tempted Eve and she and Adam ate the forbidden fruit, their eyes were suddenly open and they covered themselves with leaves. Remember when Lyra was saying that she used to swim naked all the time with Roger and her other friends without even thinking about it, but with Will it was totally different? She couldn't just strip naked and swim in the water with him without feeling... different. This is very similar to how Adam and Eve were very comfortable walking around naked with each other but once they ate the fruit, they covered themselves. Lyra was comfortable naked with Roger, not all that out there with someone she has feelings for.

Dr. Malone tempted Lyra by telling her the story of how she fell in love for the first time when the boy put the marzipan to her lips. As Lyra and Will are eating while taking a break from catching their Dæmon, Lyra takes a piece of FRUIT and places it to Will's lips. Eve gave fruit to Adam. Then they suddenly both become aware of each other's feelings for one another. Eve and Adam's eyes are open. They lose their child innocence by experiencing a feeling they've never felt before and soon after, once they go so far as to touch each other's Dæmon, the Dæmon change into their permanent form, just as Adam and Eve's stopped changing forms as well (in the Golden Compass Dæmon version of Adam and Eve).

In the story of Adam and Eve... Adam and Eve have sex... so that makes me to kinda believe that Lyra and Will did as well since the stories are so paralleled. (And... after the horrible experiences they've gone through, I wouldn't blame them for going crazy with each other. Plus, they are pretty daring characters..)HOWEVER, I found this while I was writing this post and it really confused me. Please let me know what you make of it.

The Amber Spyglass: Preemptive Absolution. US edition.
"The child, then, is in the position of Eve, the wife of Adam, the mother of us all, and the cause of all sin."
"Please, remember- the alethiometer does not forecast; it says 'IF certain things come about, THEN the consequences will be...,' and so on. And it says that if it comes about that the child is tempted, as Eve was, then she is likely to fall. On the outcome will depend... everything. And if this temptation does take place, and if the child gives in, then Dust and sin will triumph."

What if the sin were to be if Lyra and Will gave into their love and decided to leave an open window anywhere, causing the world to eventually end? Because it's saying that she needed to make a choice and the choice is what would make or break the universe. They DIDN'T become Adam and Eve. She was LIKELY to fall. Not for sure to fall. Sure, they followed the story of Adam and Eve... up until they needed to make the crucial decision. They could have been the next Adam and Eve by leaving another window open, getting married, and having a family, thus eventually ending the life by having Dust leave completely. But.. then that confuses me too. lol. Because it says "then Dust and sin will triumph." Well... if they both left a window open, Dust wouldn't triumph... it would leave completely. Gaaaaa I'm so confused. But tell me what you think about this.

So maybe they didn't have sex since in the end, they didn't experience the final part of the story of Adam and Eve.

UGH. I have no idea lol. WHATEVER. I'm still sticking to my initial thought of them making love under the trees or wherever the hell they were.

[master_druid]

I find it very possible, and somewhat likely, that they did, despite their age. I believe this, although I can't really prove it to me or anyone else. I think it's the way he wrote it; "everything about her was soft" maybe.